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	<title>Comments on: BoingBoing Believes in Bullshit</title>
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	<description>One geeks thoughts on the geekeries of the world.</description>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://www.apreche.net/boingboing-believes-in-bullshit/comment-page-1/#comment-51</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jan 2006 01:15:35 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The study I referenced said that the zinc nasal gel they tested had &quot;no effect on total symptom score&quot; which means no alleviation of symptoms. So, in this case, it did not prevent a cold or alleviate symptoms. I call that a total failure. Read carefully!

Also, there have been only 3 studies on Zicam ( the second of which corrected flaws in the first and showed no effect). The other studies you probably read were done using similar delivery techniques but they did not test Zicam specifically. Hardly overwhelming evidence, eh?

For a overview of the current research you might look at 
http://tinyurl.com/85pzj and http://tinyurl.com/7k9rc

The conclusions are tentatively positive about nasal zinc delivery but far from conclusive (and certainly no endorsement of Zicam) and there is a strong warning about loss of the sense of smell.

Agreed that the FDA needs to get involved.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The study I referenced said that the zinc nasal gel they tested had &#8220;no effect on total symptom score&#8221; which means no alleviation of symptoms. So, in this case, it did not prevent a cold or alleviate symptoms. I call that a total failure. Read carefully!</p>
<p>Also, there have been only 3 studies on Zicam ( the second of which corrected flaws in the first and showed no effect). The other studies you probably read were done using similar delivery techniques but they did not test Zicam specifically. Hardly overwhelming evidence, eh?</p>
<p>For a overview of the current research you might look at<br />
<a href="http://tinyurl.com/85pzj" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/85pzj</a> and <a href="http://tinyurl.com/7k9rc" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/7k9rc</a></p>
<p>The conclusions are tentatively positive about nasal zinc delivery but far from conclusive (and certainly no endorsement of Zicam) and there is a strong warning about loss of the sense of smell.</p>
<p>Agreed that the FDA needs to get involved.</p>
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		<title>By: Apreche</title>
		<link>http://www.apreche.net/boingboing-believes-in-bullshit/comment-page-1/#comment-50</link>
		<dc:creator>Apreche</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jan 2006 23:43:59 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>You think I&#039;m caving? I don&#039;t think so. I only caved on one point. I also searched pubmed, like you, and I found many studies relating to zicam. I found multiple studies, only one of which was funded by Zicam. More than one of them provided significant evidence that Zincum Gluconium nasal gels are effective at getting rid of the symptoms of a cold. 

Take notice that the study you linked doesn&#039;t contradict these other studies. The negative study you linked says that Zicam is not effective at preventing colds. It says nothing about alleviation of symptoms. Read carefully!

So I only caved on one point, that Zicam can relieve cold symptoms. I agree with eveything else you say. I still do not suggest that anyone use Zicam and I do not condone the promotion of its use on BoingBoing. The FDA really needs to come down on shit like this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You think I&#8217;m caving? I don&#8217;t think so. I only caved on one point. I also searched pubmed, like you, and I found many studies relating to zicam. I found multiple studies, only one of which was funded by Zicam. More than one of them provided significant evidence that Zincum Gluconium nasal gels are effective at getting rid of the symptoms of a cold. </p>
<p>Take notice that the study you linked doesn&#8217;t contradict these other studies. The negative study you linked says that Zicam is not effective at preventing colds. It says nothing about alleviation of symptoms. Read carefully!</p>
<p>So I only caved on one point, that Zicam can relieve cold symptoms. I agree with eveything else you say. I still do not suggest that anyone use Zicam and I do not condone the promotion of its use on BoingBoing. The FDA really needs to come down on shit like this.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://www.apreche.net/boingboing-believes-in-bullshit/comment-page-1/#comment-49</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jan 2006 21:35:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.apreche.net/2006/01/21/boingboing-believes-in-bullshit/#comment-49</guid>
		<description>I think you&#039;re caving to fast, Apreche.

First, it has not been &quot;scientifically proven&quot; that such nasal gels work. There have been some positive results (btw, the only &#039;independent&#039; Zicam study was funded by Zicam) but there have been negative ones, too. &quot;Zinc treatment had no effect on total symptom score, rhinorrhea, nasal obstruction, or the proportion of infected volunteers who developed clinical colds.&quot; ( http://tinyurl.com/8ml7h )

It&#039;s akin to saying healing prayer has been scientifically proven because some studies were positive. You have to have much bigger data set to reach such conclusions.

Secondly, aside from what appears to be a genuine risk of losing your sense of smell, I&#039;m not sure how enthusiastic I would be about buying or endorsing products, particularly those that I use in my body, from companies that have to commit fraud to get them into the marketplace by mis-labeling them to get around the FDA.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you&#8217;re caving to fast, Apreche.</p>
<p>First, it has not been &#8220;scientifically proven&#8221; that such nasal gels work. There have been some positive results (btw, the only &#8216;independent&#8217; Zicam study was funded by Zicam) but there have been negative ones, too. &#8220;Zinc treatment had no effect on total symptom score, rhinorrhea, nasal obstruction, or the proportion of infected volunteers who developed clinical colds.&#8221; ( <a href="http://tinyurl.com/8ml7h" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/8ml7h</a> )</p>
<p>It&#8217;s akin to saying healing prayer has been scientifically proven because some studies were positive. You have to have much bigger data set to reach such conclusions.</p>
<p>Secondly, aside from what appears to be a genuine risk of losing your sense of smell, I&#8217;m not sure how enthusiastic I would be about buying or endorsing products, particularly those that I use in my body, from companies that have to commit fraud to get them into the marketplace by mis-labeling them to get around the FDA.</p>
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		<title>By: Apreche</title>
		<link>http://www.apreche.net/boingboing-believes-in-bullshit/comment-page-1/#comment-47</link>
		<dc:creator>Apreche</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Jan 2006 05:25:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.apreche.net/2006/01/21/boingboing-believes-in-bullshit/#comment-47</guid>
		<description>Alright, I guess some sort of apology/correction is in order. 

First off, after some cursory research I have discovered a few things. 

Zincum gluconium nasal gel has been scientifically proven to help reduce the symptoms of the common cold. Homeopathic &quot;medicine&quot; is indeed complete bullshit. Zicam isn&#039;t actually homeopathic, it only claims to be in order to avoid FDA regulations. 

There is a pretty good chance that yes indeed Zicam does indeed damage your olfactory senses. It might not happen to 100% of users, but loss of smell is definitely on the &quot;side effects may include:&quot; list. This is the reason Zicam called itself homeopathic to avoid FDA regulation. It never would have passed the FDA with a side effect like that. 

So. If you really really want to get rid of your cold, go ahead and use it. Keep in mind it does not actually get rid of the common cold, only the symptoms of cold. Don&#039;t confuse the two, they are very different. 

In summary I was somewhat wrong. But Zicam is still not something I can approve of. Is a cold really that bad? I don&#039;t take any medicine when I have a cold and it goes away after a few days. I think you&#039;re all a bunch of sissies. I&#039;d like colds to go away, but it&#039;s definitely not worth risking my sense of smell.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alright, I guess some sort of apology/correction is in order. </p>
<p>First off, after some cursory research I have discovered a few things. </p>
<p>Zincum gluconium nasal gel has been scientifically proven to help reduce the symptoms of the common cold. Homeopathic &#8220;medicine&#8221; is indeed complete bullshit. Zicam isn&#8217;t actually homeopathic, it only claims to be in order to avoid FDA regulations. </p>
<p>There is a pretty good chance that yes indeed Zicam does indeed damage your olfactory senses. It might not happen to 100% of users, but loss of smell is definitely on the &#8220;side effects may include:&#8221; list. This is the reason Zicam called itself homeopathic to avoid FDA regulation. It never would have passed the FDA with a side effect like that. </p>
<p>So. If you really really want to get rid of your cold, go ahead and use it. Keep in mind it does not actually get rid of the common cold, only the symptoms of cold. Don&#8217;t confuse the two, they are very different. </p>
<p>In summary I was somewhat wrong. But Zicam is still not something I can approve of. Is a cold really that bad? I don&#8217;t take any medicine when I have a cold and it goes away after a few days. I think you&#8217;re all a bunch of sissies. I&#8217;d like colds to go away, but it&#8217;s definitely not worth risking my sense of smell.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://www.apreche.net/boingboing-believes-in-bullshit/comment-page-1/#comment-46</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Jan 2006 17:24:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.apreche.net/2006/01/21/boingboing-believes-in-bullshit/#comment-46</guid>
		<description>Mark, you say you don&#039;t take homeopathic medicines yet the very first question/answer in the Zicam FAQ is:

Q. What is Zicam Cold Remedy?
A. Zicam Cold Remedy is an over-the-counter homeopathic medicine that actually reduces the duration and severity of the common cold when taken at the first sign of cold symptoms.

http://www.zicam.com/FAQ.aspx</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark, you say you don&#8217;t take homeopathic medicines yet the very first question/answer in the Zicam FAQ is:</p>
<p>Q. What is Zicam Cold Remedy?<br />
A. Zicam Cold Remedy is an over-the-counter homeopathic medicine that actually reduces the duration and severity of the common cold when taken at the first sign of cold symptoms.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.zicam.com/FAQ.aspx" rel="nofollow">http://www.zicam.com/FAQ.aspx</a></p>
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		<title>By: Mark Frauenfelder</title>
		<link>http://www.apreche.net/boingboing-believes-in-bullshit/comment-page-1/#comment-45</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Frauenfelder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Jan 2006 15:24:39 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I am an idiot for many reasons, but not the one you suggest here, Scott.  I do not take homeopathic medicines, because I don&#039;t think they work. 

Zicam is *not* homeopathic, even though it is labeled as such. Matrixx called it homepathic to get it on the shelves without FDA approval.

Did you read the studies about efficacy of the active ingredient in Zicam, zincum gluconium, on colds? I did. Here&#039;s one if you are interested:

http://www.zicam.com/pdf/Zinc_nasal_gel_treatment_common_cold_symptoms.pdf</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am an idiot for many reasons, but not the one you suggest here, Scott.  I do not take homeopathic medicines, because I don&#8217;t think they work. </p>
<p>Zicam is *not* homeopathic, even though it is labeled as such. Matrixx called it homepathic to get it on the shelves without FDA approval.</p>
<p>Did you read the studies about efficacy of the active ingredient in Zicam, zincum gluconium, on colds? I did. Here&#8217;s one if you are interested:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.zicam.com/pdf/Zinc_nasal_gel_treatment_common_cold_symptoms.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.zicam.com/pdf/Zinc_nasal_gel_treatment_common_cold_symptoms.pdf</a></p>
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